Went out on Sunday, now Twinspark BCR won't start

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:24 pm

Having 'fixed' the starter motor 6 weeks ago after which it started perfectly & several times in succession I managed to get the bike out yesterday.

25 miles out & 25 miles back in the sun.

Got it out & started normally using cold start lever, but stopped it to check fuel level (full) then had trouble re starting & thought I may have flooded it at the time, so left for a couple of minutes.

Re started ok, but not quite as well as usual, seemed a bit grumpy. Went off & parked up after 25 miles, started ok later from cold & went home, parked up outside garage & left it ticking over whilst I opened up, didn't seem to be ticking over as well as usual. Stuck her in the garage, stopped the engine &thought I'd try a restart, turned over & sort of tried but wouldn't fire so left it & stuck the charger on (CTK or is it CKT not sure, but the right one for an Odyssey).

Went back later & tried again, no fire.
Tried again about 1/2 an hour ago, turned over plenty good but no start or even a hint of it.

Battery fully charged & turning over healthily
Fuel pump presurising
Couldn't smell any petrol
2/3 of a tank of juice (filled up 6 weeks ago)

Just going to have another go before coming back to listen to the TT.

Any suggestions on where to start looking?

Rob

eyore · Post by **eyore** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:22 pm

I'd check a few basics and pop out the plugs, check the colour and check for spark. Take the injectors out and see if they are injecting fuel (into a jar). At the end of the day you need spark fuel and compression

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Tue Jun 09, 2015 1:26 pm

Yes, that's my first step but won't get a chance to look till Sunday.

Was hoping someone would pop up & say they had exactly the same thing happen to them & it was very simple fix, just tighten the passenger footrest and all will be cured...........

Motocod · Post by **Motocod** » Tue Jun 09, 2015 2:49 pm

Maybe a loose battery terminal?

eyore · Post by **eyore** » Tue Jun 09, 2015 5:04 pm

stivesvelo wrote: Was hoping someone would pop up & say they had exactly the same thing happen to them & it was very simple fix, just tighten the passenger footrest and all will be cured...........

Oh all right then, just knock off the kill switch.

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Wed Jun 10, 2015 7:24 pm

managed to get home early...so

Tried the kill switch (first port of call after a friend dismantled his Ducati on the forecourt of a petrol station only to find after an hour or so that he'd knocked the kill switch by accident), so that's ok as it seems to disconnect the fuel pump, so I can hear that pressuring up.

Took the left plug out & turned it over, spark didn't look too bright but it was in direct sunlight so may have been better than I thought (seemed weak & yellow to me though)

Whilst I was turning it over without a plug in it fired & almost started, tried again & same thing so put the plug back & it started!

What did I do?

1 Choke at first click
2 Turned engine over & it caught & started, nice tick over.
3 Tried again with the choke fully advanced and wouldn't start (this is what I usually do from cold)
4 Tried with choke back at original position & it started fine again & settled into a nice steady tick over, tried a couple more times and same again, started fine & ticks over nice & solid.

I'm wondering if it could be a dreaded stick coil (or two) or just be in need of new plugs (looked ok to me, perhaps a bit on the lean side but maybe that's how it should be).

19.5 k miles & fully serviced to date.

Is there any way of testing a stick coil other than substituting?

eyore · Post by **eyore** » Wed Jun 10, 2015 7:59 pm

Never need choke on mine, starts fine without touching it.

nab 301 · Post by **nab 301** » Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:42 pm

I don't have a twin spark but over the years switching off immediately after a cold start and attempting a restart immediately has nearly always resulted in poor starting and flooded symptoms , never failed to start though. I just put it down to a primitive fuel injection system.
The cold start lever is just that , ( it's not a choke /enrichment device) it just opens the throttle bodies slightly for a fast idle. If starting is easier without , maybe the tb's need balancing ? or maybe one of the throttle cables is a bit sticky.
A stick coil could be on the way out too
viewtopic.php?t=19343&highlight=coil+testing

Motocod · Post by **Motocod** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 7:30 am

Someone on here recently suggested to me that you pull the HT lead for the lower plug while the bike is running. If the stick coil is good it should keep running.

The Teutonic Tangerine · Thu Jun 11, 2015 8:29 am

Motocod wrote:Someone on here recently suggested to me that you pull the HT lead for the lower plug while the bike is running. If the stick coil is good it should keep running.

.

Both plugs have a stick coil if you remove one and it keeps running it means the one you left on is good so you would have to remove each in turn to track down and offending stick. My understanding is that the lower plugs fire a little later than the main plugs (milli seconds) but if you have a duff stick and you remove the remaining one it should identify a duff stick easily.

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 10:03 am

Bugger, tried again this morning before I went to work & doesn't want to play wherever the cold start lever is....
back to the drawing board!

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 11:46 am

Unfortunately no time to look, I need to move it to another garage with elbow room before I start taking things to bits, may need to wait till sunday.

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 7:50 pm

Strange...it starts ok now, disconnected lower plugs alternately & started fine each time.

Checked fuses, connectors, battery connections, starter connections (had it off a few weeks ago to repair so may have been there), good look about.

Checked side stand switch, works fine up & down, on & off, in & out of gear as it should.

Turned handlebars this way & that, waggled cables to handlebars.

Only difference between this morning & other times that it wouldn't start is that when sat on side stand it wouldn't start (hence testing switch on stand) & when on Abba stand it would.

Took it off Abba & put back in garage on side stand, started ok, have given up this evening for the time being as food calls..

I'll try disconnecting the stick coil on one side at a time next to see if it will run on one pot at a time, if it does I guess that's a good enough test for the coil??

Mitch1100 · Post by **Mitch1100** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 11:50 pm

Fuel filter/bad fuel?

stivesvelo · Post by **stivesvelo** » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:15 pm

Possibly, but it's not due yet so I'll try a few other things first before doing the filter, I think it's due at the next service so may as well get one in along with the other bits.

BTW thanks for that link Nigel, useful to have a good explanation that I can understand!